Speaking of React/Angular - they are obsessed because they never used 10-years-old computers and slow Internet connection and don't actually know how users feel when their weak machines are thrown all that stuff at.
I'm not against new concepts. Client-side rendering is awesome, reactivity is awesome. But I'm against all that bloatware. If a new concept can't be implemented without bloatware (hint: it can), we don't really need it.
But these things can and should be done in a different way. For example, all my JS stack (Z5 + DaBi) targets ES5 and is under 4 KB altogether. Yet it provides:
- DOM manipulation and auto-polyfilling some DOM essentials (only for the stuff that's really uncomfortable to do with native APIs - Q.js);
- reactive in-memory storage (with an ability to easily populate from external objects or remote requests - Zen.js);
- easy data-to-DOM and DOM-to-data binding (DaBi library);
- ability to easily build DOM and CSS styles from JS native constructs (XT.js and XS.js - never go through escaping hell again);
- client-side routing (R.js).
And while I agree that React/Angular are the bloatware (even jQuery is), I disagree that server-side rendering is any better and that throwing in another bloatware like ClojureScript would solve this issue. Like I had said in my article about client-side development (http://clientside.surge.sh/), go native or go home.
Hint: a lot smaller than almost all the CSV files I've had to deal with.
To the grandparent: you might want to make it more explicit that you're actually retaining the uploaded data and not just using it to generate the result page.
How about the "read the article" hivemind? There's a bit of a difference between "knowingly violated the terms of service" and "told we were in 100% compliance with the rules".
Also, if you want a dumb crime analogy, imagine a situation where robbers get locked up... but only if they voted for a particular party. Uneven enforcement based on whim is a bad thing. Especially when someone is trying extremely hard to follow the rules.
I honestly think the entire idea of downvoting available only for selected users creates a mass conciousness manipulation tool. When some "authority" decides what's good and what's bad.
Why can't I use the downvote button? It either must be available to everyone, or not available at all.
And if you, HN founders, are afraid that newcomers can be smarter than you, then remove the ability to downvote altogether. Whoever dislikes a post, can just ignore it.
P.S. The entire user rating system here contradicts the resource name. Hackers do not believe in karma.
Do you realize that you just said, in essence, that you have to be popular in order to dissent? That's like saying only celebrities should be allowed to voice their opinion.
in essence, that you have to be popular in order to dissent?
No, I am not saying that. And if I understand the dissent correctly being used in the sentence thus, hold or express opinions that are at variance with those previously, commonly, or officially expressed, you are already doing that to my post as an example and you didn't have to be popular to express such an opinion.:)
Voting is a form of expression, and a comment has much less weight than a downvote in terms of ranking.
The only way to be able to express that type of opinion is by complying with the masses long enough to hoard enough karma. So, yes, only the "popular" people get that power.
Reaching a karma threshold does not signify popularity, but it can indicate that the user has somewhat of a track record of likely being able to engage in civil, informed commentary.
You can post a dissenting comment with 0 points. You just can't contribute a silent, negative assessment of a comment until you have 500 points.
I'm not sure it takes popularity to make comments that average upvotes either (I would attribute my thousands of fake points more to persistence than to popularity...).
I find it comical that the number is 500. It used to be much lower (Google searches show that).
HN keeps raising the bar in order to limit the # of people who can downvote. I would be genuinely interested to know what % of users that actually is.
The only way to get a large number of upvotes is to be lucky enough to post something at just the right time, or to make a comment on a controversial topic that most of the HN audience will agree with. Be careful, though, that you make the right political statement, though, because otherwise you will get downvoted and lose karma.
The story for most of us, though, is that we're just a second-class citizen here at HN.
So again, is this Hacker News or Karma-Jerkin-Conformist News?
It seems that in order to "earn" that "ability" one has to praise Lisp, Rust and Haskell and publicly hate JS. Isn't that mass conciousness manipulation?
The selected few or a crowd thinking the same thought - what's the actual difference? The only difference is that in the second case all fresh and independent ideas get downvoted much faster.
Any karma-based resource suffers from this plague.
There's no actual challenge in getting upvotes, the two easiest ways are:
* make smart well-thought-out well-backed-up posts
* submit interesting links
> If something has had enough downvotes to go invisible it's nearly always because offensive, smartass, or spam.
Why does someone has more right than me to decide what's offensive, smartass or spam? Either leave that to the administration, or give that to everyone.
> The problem with downvote for everyone, including sock puppet accounts, is it becomes Reddit: "I disagree, have a downvote"
YMMV but I'm experiencing absolutely the same here.
Btw, when I agree, I upvote. Why can't I downvote when I disagree?
> Why does someone has more right than me to decide what's offensive, smartass or spam? Either leave that to the administration, or give that to everyone.
Actually, there are several immutable FS-over-tinyURL projects. I have created some of them too. A real problem with Twitter is that you can get banned quickly for doing this.
I'm not against new concepts. Client-side rendering is awesome, reactivity is awesome. But I'm against all that bloatware. If a new concept can't be implemented without bloatware (hint: it can), we don't really need it.
But these things can and should be done in a different way. For example, all my JS stack (Z5 + DaBi) targets ES5 and is under 4 KB altogether. Yet it provides:
- DOM manipulation and auto-polyfilling some DOM essentials (only for the stuff that's really uncomfortable to do with native APIs - Q.js);
- reactive in-memory storage (with an ability to easily populate from external objects or remote requests - Zen.js);
- easy data-to-DOM and DOM-to-data binding (DaBi library);
- ability to easily build DOM and CSS styles from JS native constructs (XT.js and XS.js - never go through escaping hell again);
- client-side routing (R.js).
And while I agree that React/Angular are the bloatware (even jQuery is), I disagree that server-side rendering is any better and that throwing in another bloatware like ClojureScript would solve this issue. Like I had said in my article about client-side development (http://clientside.surge.sh/), go native or go home.